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D&D 3E
Aha, another one that stumps me... 
7th-Sep-2006 02:52 pm
Can you sunder somebodies arm...? What is the hardness/hitpoints of a limb...? If you catch someone flat-footed, does the defender get a roll to avoid being disarmed/weapon sundered...? What if they are blinded, or you're invisible...? As a DM, I like to sunder peoples stuff alot, because I'm a right bastard...
7th-Sep-2006 05:25 am (UTC)
I have no idea, but you're one malicious little man.

(That's a compliment.)
7th-Sep-2006 05:45 am (UTC)
Stumps, ha ha.

The Book of Vile Darkness might have the answers you're looking for.
7th-Sep-2006 07:59 am (UTC)
strictly speaking, no you cant sunder body parts as it messes up the abstract HP mechanic. Only example i can think of in 3.x of this is the hydra - IIRC each neck has the monsters natural AC and a tenth the HP of the total monster. SO if you do want to play with it, there's a codified mechanic right there.

I'd say only bonus to sunder/disarm a flatfooted person is they dont get to make an AoO (unless combat reflexes).
7th-Sep-2006 03:19 pm (UTC)
1)Strictly speaking, you cannot be sundered. That's not to say that you can't lose a limb, but such things are often best left for dramatic critical hits.

I wouldn't force a PC to lose a limb unless their circumstances were already dire in nature and losing that limb would be the least of their worries.

2) You always get a roll to defend your weapon, whether it's being attacked directly, knocked from your hand, or yanked from your grasp. Unless you're helpless or unconcious. Simply being surprised doesn't render you helpless. =]

3) Since you come out of invisibility when you begin such an action to disarm or sunder, yes, your opponent still gets a roll. They might be slightly disturbed, but they still get a roll. Even with things with natural invisibility, such as an Invisible Stalker or a Pixie, you still get your defensive roll, though the DM may feel free to penalize it as he sees fit.

Sunder sunder sunder sunder....as a DM, I do not sunder. As a player I generally do not sunder. One of my PC's has a tendency to direct his psionic missiles at the enemies weapons, though, so I have to deal with it all the time. -_-
7th-Sep-2006 05:52 pm (UTC)
3) Only the "Invisibility" spell creates the form of invisibility that causes tou to stop being invisibly when you attack, but even then you are invisible whe you make the attack

8th-Sep-2006 03:22 am (UTC)
Find me a player that can poof into invisibility without recourse to some form of the Invisibility spell, and I'll find you a player who is broken.

That aside, your distinction between being invisible as you make the attack and ceasing to be invisible immediately after it is made is a matter of a split second, and thereby means nothing in game terms. If an invisible attacker takes a swing at your face, you'll be flat-footed (which I didn't dispute) but if he's taking a swing at your weapon, your weapon can't be flat-footed...unless it's sentient.
8th-Sep-2006 11:52 am (UTC)
I didn't say "player", and I didn't say "some form of the Invisibility Spell". PCs and NPCs alike can use Greater Invisibility for instance.

Sunder is a special attack (and therefore breaks an Invisibility spell, though I admit there doesn't seem to be any difference between sundering a whip and cutting the rope someone is climbing, the latter of which does not count as an attack) and carried weapons have an AC based on that of their wearer (unless activiely fighting with it, when you get an opposed attack roll instead). So being flatfooted counts would be relevant (if an invisible character makes you flatfooted, which it doesn't). You do lose your DEX bonus, but you still get an attack of opportunity against the Sunder attempt.

(I *think* the sunderer would still always invisible under Invisibility when they take the AoO, as they happen before any of the effects of the thing that provoked them)
8th-Sep-2006 06:14 pm (UTC)
(Though Invisibility Sphere is as brittle as Invisibility so it is not *just* Invisibility...)
10th-Sep-2006 09:33 am (UTC)
The AoO doesn't stop the sunder attempt though. I wonder too, would you get an AoO, if you do, do you then get one if someone invisible walks past you(moves through your threatened area)? I think I'd say not.
The biggest issue with the question is probably deciding on whether you consider a body part a held or carried "object" I certainly wouldn't; although if you used a sunder as an AoO against an unarmed attack that might be tempting.
8th-Sep-2006 01:51 am (UTC)
I instituted a Sundering rule -- You don't break my shit, and I don't break your shit. One player had a character who used to sunder everything. I asked him in private to knock it off, he didn't, and then he met the warlock with the eldrich spear blast shape and the ranged sunder feat. It froke all of hsi shit from hundreds of feet away, and then Tim'd him to death.
8th-Sep-2006 03:23 am (UTC)
That's a good rule.

And a great follow through.
7th-Sep-2006 04:25 pm (UTC)
aren't you trying to sunder a person every time u roll an attack roll?
8th-Sep-2006 03:22 am (UTC)
Only if you're making a call shot to the nards.
8th-Sep-2006 03:31 am (UTC)
there are no more called shots, so by default u're trying to "sunder" people all the time, isn't it?
8th-Sep-2006 03:32 pm (UTC)
7th-Sep-2006 05:47 pm (UTC)
We once faced a half-troll with a glaive. He had some fighter and rogue levels. He tried to sunder a weapon I had at my waist (being a cleric, I rarely use it anyway) with one of his multiple attacks.

My first thought was, "Whew, I'm glad he didn't attack me instead. That guy's pretty strong and I wouldn't want a crit." Then I used command to make him drop the glaive and we hacked him to pieces.

The DM didn't waste time sundering stuff after that.
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